Customers' pictures and movies from drag racing competitions. Im with you on AFM is crap. Sonnax highlights two product lines for helping with heavy solenoids for GM/Ford 10L/10R and 9T series transmissions. Accelerate from a stop with light throttle (15%), ensuring that upshifts 1st through 8th occur at engine speeds between 1300-1600 rpm. LS2/TH400 vs L92/6L80e | Pirate 4x4 Electronic challenges exist when mixing and matching the 6L80 as they must be matched to their particular engine. For instance, transmission techs with any time under their belts can tell you all about 3-4 clutch failure in GM 4L60-Es, intermediate stub shaft failure in Ford 4R70Ws and solenoid issues in Aisin AW 55-50s. The bottom line: The very thin (.020") woven carbon friction material cant survive the way the JMBX piston applies. SEE, I think it's a 15 pin plug and two wires change on the plug fro 95 to. Its a single-disc, non-captive clutch unit that is somewhat similar to late 300mm 4L60-E converters. Lots of good information I do have one question That no one seems to be able to give a good answer to. The transmission will bolt up but will not work since the TCM, Tehcm and BCM are application specific and cannot interchanged. At times the 10-speed transmission may skip gears when the vehicle starts from a complete stop. Then, because the six-speed is splitting ratios, the rpm drop between gears is less because TCI has turned this into a five-speed automatic with an overdrive. The 6L80E went mostly into large vehicles with V8 motors. Structurally, the 8L90 is similar to the 8L45, except that it is made to handle more power and torque. Reply. The 6L80 was, from the ground up, developed as an electric over hydraulic transmission with microprocessor control. A P59 PCM controlled both the engine and the transmission. Ive not done the math on total surface area, but its likely the clutch would not last long engaging 450 hp. 97 it's a, I have a 2007 h3 hummer base model. After an internal inspection of your transmission, we will notify you of any hard part damage that will carry an additional cost. Dissecting the E-Ray, the First Hybrid AWD Vette. As such, Sonnax has a good view of both sides of the pump, so we are intimately involved with engineering solutions to both trending transmission AND converter issues. It also contains a durable transmission pan, reliable gear seat, EPC, a 13-vane pump assembly, high-performance cooler, hardened stator shaft with rings and specialized control solenoids. NonStop-Transmission. By utilizing more gearing, the 6L80 keeps the car in its power band longer, improving the MPG of the vehicle between 4-7% (over the previous generation fours speed transmissions) depending on the configuration of the vehicle that its in. So my suggestion is to not subject the lockup to that amount of abuse. 6L80 / 6L90 TEHCM Problems & Solutions - Transmission Repair Cost Guide * WILL ALLOW USE . The GM transmission is the 10L80, which is available in several models as well. Also, Im not sure if the trans will allow converter lockup at WOT. In contrast, when the 10-speed transmission is at heavy or max throttle, the small steps keep the engine closer to the horsepower peak for the best performance. That year, for the first time, the 10R80 ten-speed transmission was available with the 2.7-liter EcoBoost V6, 3.5-liter EcoBoost V6, or 5.0-liter Coyote V8 engine options and was even an option with their popular Raptor model. (incl. I am interested in enhancing my vehicles performance. This creates the situation where the engine drops less rpm from First to Second gear. I have a 2012 Corvette Grand Sport Auto trans. This allows him to see what kinds of issues some of these transmissions come back to the dealer with while under warranty. Third 2.15 They can then use these unseen components throughout their different product lines and improve their profit margins through the lower shared development costs. The Novak Guide to the GM 4L80E Automatic Transmission $3,245*. The way the power is applied is different than the 4L80E / TH-400. TH350 High Performance Transmissions / 850 Hp Full Race, TH400 High Performance Transmissions / Stage II - Stage VI, TH200-4R High Performance Transmissions / Stage I - Stage III och Full Race, TH700R4 / 4L60E / 4l65E High Performance Transmissions / Stage II - Stage V, 4L80E / 4L85E High Performance Transmissions / Stage I - Stage V, 6L80E / 6L90E High Performance Transmissions / Standard - 1000Hp, Speed Potential Calculator for Ring Gear and Pinion Changes, Engine Alternatives. Upon a test drive and a scan, code P0741 is noted and the percentage of TCC slip shows to be way out of range. The TMBX and the JMBX have similar covers and use the same woven carbon friction material, yet the JMBX fails catastrophically at a very high rate and the TMBX cover rarely fails. full. $ 158.00 Select options. Where the original 4L80E First gear is 2.48:1, TCI created a 2.97:1 First gear ratio. $499.00. Newer to the transmission world is its use of direct clutch-to-clutch shifting and the total lack of bands. How do Sonnax components prevent the failure that plagues these units? About 80% of issues are cured by updating the programming. Comes with a complete harness and the necessary software to program the TCM-2650 Module. Nothing but problems with it big clunks, engine revs up before grabbing a gear. Copyright 2023 - Transmission Repair Cost Guide. Thanks for the question! Statements on 6L80E trans with LS engine. Since 2003, Jeff has held various positions at Car Craft (including editor), has written books on small block Chevy performance, and even cultivated an impressive collection of 1965 and 1966 Chevelles. As these units accumulate more mileage, these concerns may become more frequent. With its 2017-2018 heralding, Ford has equipped 3 domestic models with the 10R80 transmission. As a result, it became a popular choice despite sharing most of its internal components with its predecessor, the 700R4. If you know the RPO code for the transmission you are golden. GM 10L80: A new kind of pump noise. Transmission Pan Bolt Set Chevy 6L80E 6L90E 8L80E 8L90E 10L80E 10L90E 18pcs. A typical scene thats now playing out in transmission shops across the country goes something like this: A late-model, full-size truck or SUV is dropped off to get the transmission checked out. The gearing spread is a very capable 6.04, with ratios in each gear as follows: First: 4.02, Second: 2.36, Third: 1.53, Fourth: 1.15, Fifth: .085, Sixth: 0.67, Reverse: 3.06. Bolt and gasket inlcuded. Accelerator pedal position: Directly affects shift scheduling, TCC scheduling, and transmission diagnostics. Specialized manifold for 10L80,10L90, 8L90, 6L80, and 6L90 transmissions, allowing you to connect -6AN fittings to your cooler lines. The TCM-2600/2650 is used to enable the use of the GM 6l50e, 6L80E, 6l90E, 6T70E and 6T75 E transmissions behind practically any engine. GM has been useless to say the least, and waited me out (now off warranty). *$3,245 does not include any Hard Part damage, Torque Converter or TCM/ECM tuning. Knowledge is power use it to protect your customer, your unit and yourself for miles and miles to come. It is a 5 position shifter, Park, Reverse, Neutral, Drive and Sport Mode. The new 10-speed combo is 4.70 x 2.85 = 13.39:1. Jeff Smith has had a passion for cars since he began working at his grandfather's gas station at the age 10. This version is 1-3/8" longer and about 25% of its internal parts differ. When diagnosing this unit, it is very important to realize that the failure management programs built into the powertrain system may be a direct reflection of the customers drivability complaint. Powertrain Expo Transmission Report: 6L80, 6L90 Transmission Tech Advisory: Consider an Updated Converter in Your Next Rebuild. How is this different from the GM 6L80E transmission that is used in the Corvette or in the newer GM trucks? However some 2wd vans and HD truck versions had a, J Series Trucks & Wagons, (I6 There are five main inputs the vehicle uses for transmission shift strategy, they are: The Adaptive Learning Drive Cycle must be performed after any of the following procedures are performed: Perform the adaptive learning drive cycle on a level road surface as follows: After the final step, place the vehicle in park and cycle the ignition key off. Unlike the 4L60E and 4L80E, the 6L80 is not always referred to as with the E on the end because its been over 25 years since the last non electronic GM transmission has been in production. Sonnax has a line of upgrade parts that address some of the 6L80 and 6L90 transmission weaknesses. Thought's? R.F. The 4L80E is a very large, heavy transmission but, like its original TH-400 cousin, it can absorb and transmit an enormous amount of engine torque. Will this hurt the trani? Seventh 1.00 Gen V 5.3 L83 / 8L90e / Blackbox / 80series - IH8MUD Forum Weight 230+ lbs (weight varies depending on application) When other diagnostic trouble codes are present, there can be different, specific drivability concerns caused by the failure management program. Some Tahoe and Yukon HD 6.0L, not hybrid, may also have this transmission but most have 6L80 or a 10 speed 10L80. The complaint is usually associated with the vehicle sitting for a while (after it has been running at operating temperature). As the installer was pumping fluid into the transmission from the right side of the vehicle, he was having a difficult time getting it full. Its a longitudinal transmission (thats what the L in 6L80E stands for). The location of the warmer and the routing of the hoses can vary widely. - Critical wear areas and vacuum test locations: GM 10L and Ford 10R series. Bowler Transmission Cooler Manifold for GM 6, 8, & 10 speed automatic The 10-speed first appeared in the 2017 Camaro ZL1 backing up the 650-horsepower, supercharged 6.2L engine. In a similar vein, GM Gen. IV engines do not always take kindly to other transmissions such as manuals (essentially no longer available from GM), and most automatics that predate the 6L80. Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited. Now controlled by computers, the E series transmission allowed for a wide range of tuning options. Transmission Fluid Change flush 2007-2012 Silverado GMC Sierra 6L80E But the cause he discovered was related to the pump. Do you know does the aftermarket have a fix? Page 2 August, 2019 Bulletin No. Stock capacity . Thats right, you can find a variation of this Ford GM 10-speed automatic transmission in the Ford Mustang GT and the Chevrolet Camaro ZL1! Commanded engine torque: Directly affects shift scheduling, TCC scheduling, and transmission diagnostics. Indirectly affects shift control. Over time, technicians start to see the same patterns of failures in different families of units. 3) 6L80E with fixed output flange is about 2 1/2" shorter than 4L60E and about 3 1/2" shorter than 200-4R. The 4L60E was the first generation of transmission to work with a Gen III Vortec or LS motor. Convert your american classic car with more modern technology. : 18-NA-355 Special Tools DT-52263 Transmission Fluid Exchange Kit: DT-52263-1 Block Assembly (includes fluid drain As to length, this transmission is 26-1/4" long. I am making a great deal of changes to the truck from a Procharged 5.3 to a head, cam, Fast LSXRT intake LS2 on nitrous before we build a 3.9 bore and stroke twin turbo 372ci setup. If youre having problems with your 10L80 youre going to want the most economical solution. It was created to help GM meet ever more demanding CAFE regulations on their vehicles. Foremost on the list is the Sonnax clutch apply kit. I have a 2wd 2000 regular cab stepside bed Silverado that used to make closer to 600-650 wheel horsepower with the D1-SC Procharger and 4L80E. PDF Service Bulletin - National Highway Traffic Safety Administration Ford is currently using this unit in the following vehicles: The 10R80 has ten forward speeds, one reverse speed produced through the following components: The 10R80 utilizes six shift solenoids that are listed by the factory as A-F and are linear force solenoids (Figure 1). All this is handled with application of planetary ratios. This took the dealership a much longer period of time in acquiring these bolts for Brian to complete the job. document.write("- "+yr); The 10R80 transmission is a 10-speed, rear-wheel-drive transmission that is controlled by a PCM or a TCM. We all know that automatic transmission failures can have many root causes. The GM 10L80 Hydra-Matic transmission is one such hybrid component that General Motors jointly developed with, wait for it, the Ford Motor Company! Larry Callahan Founder/Administrator of Pro-Touring.com, G-Machines.com and HostMyJunk.com To advertise on Pro-Touring.com click here Since buying the car I have been trying to learn a bit about the auto trans. Become a 6L80-E and 6L90-E expert now! And you are correct the converters in these units are experiencing a high percentage of failure and are more problematic than normal. It is a heavy duty version of the 6L80 six speed automatic with a strengthened input gearset which has two additional pinion gears for six total and a strengthened output gearset that uses wider gears than the 6L80. Change Your Address, Yes, I would like to receive emails from Gears Magazine. It has factory size tires 275/55/20. Chevrolet, Buick & GM Engines into the Jeep Ford 1.8L - 2.5L "Pinto" Engines into the Jeep 4L60E (and its tougher 4L65 & 4L70 variants). You will need to ship your transmission to us for the rebuild. Most of the larger displacement applications will have an auxiliary oil-to-air cooler in the system as well. Seems like the 6 speed auto would be better for the torque curve. 6L80E Transmission Guide & Information The 6L80 began manufacture in 2005 for release in 2006 model year GM vehicles, persisting until at least 2016 in both 6L80 and 6L90 versions. 10L80 vs 10L90 Transmissions. This seems to indicate that there will be other 10L80 transmissions that will be experiencing this same new kind of pump noise condition. Thats more than almost any other GM automatic transmission. So is the 10L90 entirely different or does it just have stronger parts? The Ford 10R80 has a fill plug and dipstick on the passenger side of the case like the 6R80 transmission. Based around the 4L80E (and fitting wherever a 4L80E will fit), the 6X is a true six-speed transmission that TCI rates at 850-plus horsepower. The TCM-2650 is compatible with the GM 6L45/50, 6L80/90 . You also asked about GMs new 6L80E. lbs., with a respectable GVW of 15,000 lbs. They dealership gave Brian their opinion of what was making the noise. They are listed as Type A, Type B, and Type C diagnostic trouble codes. The height of the standpipe tube attached inside the transmission to the bottom of the pan sets the oil level. LS/6L80E into G Body (El Camino) - GBodyForum Thats a great question. Thread starter 2nazty; Start date Nov 26, 2018; Nov 26, 2018 #1 2. Wait 1 second. The readers on this site are a pretty sharp bunch. US Shift Stand-Alone Transmission Controllers But its interesting to note that there is a very low cover/piston failure rate for the 4L60-E TMBX converter. Autostart / Autostop function disabled (if equipped), Transmission Adaptive Pressure Control and adaptive shift values Frozen, High line pressure (harsh shifts and engagements). But in the 6L80 JMBX, we started to look very closely at the converter itself to see if we could determine a root cause. The solenoids can be replaced separately, but only with the same type of solenoid. A used 10L80 is pulled from a wrecked vehicle, so theres no telling what may be wrong with it, or how long it will last. This wavy nature of the clutch surface is made worse with many miles of usage. Joined Feb 11, 2007 Messages 11 Location . And now, with some of these transmissions coming out of warranty, the aftermarket will soon begin to see issues that occur with them beyond their first years of life during their aging process. The thought is that the bowl shape of the TMBX is better suited towards a more even apply, and because its thinner, the TMBX piston has the ability to flex and better conform to the front cover. It is currently phasing out the 6L80/6L90 transmissions (although it hasn't done its all the way yet. Related Articles Dana offers Spicer end yokes for Allison Transmissions ATI introduces six-speed Chevy transmission performance package Georend Transmission adds Ford 6R140 transmission pan kit. You are browsing camaro6. Reactions: me32. Put simply, its the converter. Thanks to the optimal gear spacing, the engine RPM only drops approximately 20% when the 10L80 changes gear. this means that dimension "C" is usually longer than dimension "B". if (yr!=2012) I use this vehicle to tow a 20 ft 10k trailer that I use to carry a 5500lb tractor. The GM 10L80/90 transmissions began production in 2017, meaning that we're closing in on six years of this transmission being on the road. A horsepower revolution spawned by GM's increasingly powerful Gen. III+ V8 engines and their aggressive platforms such as the Cadillac STSV, XLRV, various trucks and SUV's and the venerable Corvette. Production Began 2017 Note, some customers may complain of a converter type whine noise coming from the transmission. How quickly time passes by. Tenth 0.64 For a type A code, the MIL will illuminate after one drive cycle with the malfunction present. The complaints may be difficult to duplicate. The 6L80 is a robust transmission and can handle a ton of power. The solenoids are calibrated from the factory and are not all the same. For now, the bulk of reported cases are related to diesel vehicles. Respectfully, Len Gilbert Kitchener ON Canada. Use it to verify the vehicle has a M30 4L60ENow, if the transmission is out of the vehicle (or if you dont trust a sticker), the 6L80E has an 18 bolt case. We had to use a spacer from Advanced Adapters but otherwise they are the same. 8L90E Specs, Performance, and Identification | Drivetrain Resource To give you a sense of scope, for every single forged replacement cover that Sonnax sells for the 4L60-E TMBX, we sell many, many more for the 6L80/90 JMBX. 8 Options if Your Transmission Has Failed, Transmission Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTC), Best Remanufactured Transmission Companies, Hybrid Battery Replacement Cost and Prices, 10 Most Common Transmission Problems & How to Fix Them, How to Change Transmission Fluid Step by Step, What is a Transmission Flush?
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